DORA a WELLINGTON and a SPITFIRE

Special Forces (Axis)

Moderatoren: trapperjoe, Kuno

DORA a WELLINGTON and a SPITFIRE

Beitragvon Kuno » 12/1/2008, 11:04

I would like to quote our neighbour (http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/forum ... =320&st=20) with this interesting post to our famous SKdo DORA:

"Desert-camouflaged Wellington - I don't know the facts about this Wellington but there is a possibility which is much more probable then the use as a transport aircraft.

First the facts:

- The photograph was taken at Venice in 1942 (source: photo caption)
- On 21 Juli 1942, Est Rechlin got the order to create a spares package for a Wellington which was to be delivered with the aircraft to Sonderkommando Dora. The spares should have been procured from the DVL. (source: telex from RLM C-E 2/IIC1 to Est Rechlin, dated 21. July 1942)

My comment: The Wellington was to be used to support Sonderkommando Dora's Spitfire which was already at Gatrun at this time.

Secondly, my speculation - the desert-camouflaged Wellington is the one destined for Dora and was photographed at the transfer flight from Rechlin to Gatrun. Also, this could have been happened on the return flight as it seems that the Wellington didn't reach its destination because the reports of Dora mention the Spitfire only, but not the Wellington, and Sonderkommando Dora had to retreat after the British advance from El Alamein.

Perhaps Christoph Regel has some information of a Wellington which was at Rechlin until the end of July 1942 and of Hauptmann Gerlach, the pilot of Dora's Spitfire?
"
Zuletzt geändert von Kuno am 12/1/2008, 11:33, insgesamt 4-mal geändert.
Benutzeravatar
Kuno
Top Poster
 
Beiträge: 10180
Registriert: 28/8/2003, 14:13

Beitragvon Kuno » 12/1/2008, 11:11

It is a very interesting subject but first of all let us clarify one thing:

It was not the "Soderkommando DORA" belonging to the Abwehr, Amt 1 which made the missions with the Spitfire but eventually the "Unternehmen DORA" belonging to Abwehr Amt 2 (and only that were "Brandenburgers"!!!)

Amongst all information I have about SKdo DORA, they had many different types of planes - but never a WELLINGTON. Would like to see the telex mentioned above.
Benutzeravatar
Kuno
Top Poster
 
Beiträge: 10180
Registriert: 28/8/2003, 14:13

Beitragvon Kuestenjaeger » 12/1/2008, 11:15

Hauptmann Gerlach,it's the same pilot to fligh Mussolini and Skorzeny from Gran Sasso to Hitler,behind the rescue?
Kuestenjaeger
 

Beitragvon Kuno » 12/1/2008, 11:17

No clue about him. Would be an interesting connection then! Is there any further information about him?
Benutzeravatar
Kuno
Top Poster
 
Beiträge: 10180
Registriert: 28/8/2003, 14:13

Beitragvon Kuno » 12/1/2008, 11:37

To make the confusion a little bit worse: Whilst there is no real evidence about the captured SPITFIRE used with "Unternehmen DORA" to do some recce flights above the TIBESTI mountains, there is true evidence that "Sonderkommando DORA" actually did such flights in the same region, taking photos of the emplacements of the "Free French". These photos are existing and the origin is clear. However; "Sonderkommando DORA" has used a He.111 for these recce flights and not a captured Spitfire. Compare the profile of the two planes - the "line" of the Spitfire is a known "copy" of that of the He.70 (and therefore more than comparable with the He.111). Maybe the "Free French" observers misstook the He.111 for a Spitfire from far?
Benutzeravatar
Kuno
Top Poster
 
Beiträge: 10180
Registriert: 28/8/2003, 14:13

Beitragvon Micha » 12/1/2008, 12:50

The old problem: "Unternehmen Dora" > a Brandenburger command and the "Sonderkommando Dora" > a scientific command of the German Abwehr (counter espionage). These are very different units!!!

A Wellington aircraft Mk VIII in reality was prepared for service in the "Sonderkommando Dora" at Lecce (south Italy), but it was destroyed while a practising flight and so it never came to Africa. This information I got from one of the "Sonderkommando Dora" pilots.
But he doesn't know anything about a Spitfire in the same command. Such an aircraft had to do with the "Unternehmen Dora".

Micha
Benutzeravatar
Micha
Mitglied
 
Beiträge: 126
Registriert: 29/1/2004, 15:07
Wohnort: Willstätt

Beitragvon Kuno » 12/1/2008, 12:54

Uff! Did not expect such quick clarification! Thanks Dora äh Micha!!!
Benutzeravatar
Kuno
Top Poster
 
Beiträge: 10180
Registriert: 28/8/2003, 14:13

Beitragvon Kuno » 14/1/2008, 00:04

Micha; das ist eine Frage an dich:

"Hello Micha,

could you let us know the name of the "Sonderkommando Dora" pilot you talked to? I'm curious to see if it might be somebody from E'Stelle Rechlin, as there was a "satellite station" (Erprobungsstelle Sued") in southern Italy in the 2nd half of 1941 and also a second station "E'Stelle Tropen" in Northern Africa during the same period. So there could well be some links between Rechlin, it's outpost and such a Sonderkommando.

Christoph
"
Benutzeravatar
Kuno
Top Poster
 
Beiträge: 10180
Registriert: 28/8/2003, 14:13

Beitragvon robc » 14/1/2008, 01:47

Kuno, let me add that to mistake a He.111 for a Spitfire you need to be either drunk or at least VERY short-sighted :shock: one is a single-engined fighter and the other is a twin-engined bomber, they're very different it doesn't matter from where you look at them... Granted, the Free French might never have seen a He.111 or a Spitfire, but then they could mistake it for anything, including a Me.323 :wink:
robc
 

Beitragvon AlAghrab » 14/1/2008, 03:26

I also heard the story of the captured spitfire with "Dora" from Lloyd Owen (LRDG) - he told me that it had disappeared without trace into the desert whilst accompanying them (which I guess now would have been "Unternehmen Dora")..
AlAghrab
 

Beitragvon Kuno » 14/1/2008, 07:27

Roberto; don't forget, we talk about the French 8)
Benutzeravatar
Kuno
Top Poster
 
Beiträge: 10180
Registriert: 28/8/2003, 14:13


Zurück zu Sondereinheiten (Achse)

Wer ist online?

Mitglieder in diesem Forum: 0 Mitglieder und 1 Gast